What is wean?
- to detach from a source of dependence.
In other words, to let go and not be dependent on others. Get rid of that pacifier!
Barry said it in response to the Wisconsin protest, the closing of deaf schools, interpreter services closing, and so on.
Jerome Cain said it....(starting at 0:40 seconds)
Russell warned that unless schools for the deaf improve with better innovative academic programs and beat state academic requirements they'll soon become dinosaurs.
Gallaudet University may need to wean itself, too, eventually.
Of course, some may disagree with the whole weaning concept thinking it's cruel, never living the life of a rancher, when it's a fact of life separating calves from their mother cows as part of the whole ranching business. Whoever said that it's supposed to be a pleasant or uneventful process?
Life isn't a bed of roses.
Let's stop with the namby pamby excuses and learn to be creative, innovative and ground-breaking in order to thrive and compete successfully without the need to be overly dependent.
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35 comments:
I looked into Texas School for the Deaf's annual report from 2009-2010. Take a look at page 37. There is *NO* academic standard reports such as ACT and SAT and no reports for 12th grade. What was going on? I honestly don't think TSD's accountability Data is accurate. Sounds fishy?
http://www.tsd.state.tx.us/documents/2009_2010_Annual_Report.pdf
Another thing --
I read the article in somewhere in the internet and I could not find one. I read the article and tells me that Governor Cuomo of New York is proposing to have the $500M funding to be allocated for all public schools in 61 local districts in New York. I read Dr. Mowl's testimony proposal and it states that it would be $109M per year for 11 special/deaf schools after approx. 7 percent cut. Realized that it's the 1/5 fund that will go to 4201. The rest of 4/5 fund that will go to all district schools. Only 11 special and deaf schools would have gotten $109M per year and the rest of $391M that would go to 61 local districts! Also realized there are thousands and thousands of public schools in New York which will get 4/5 fund. only 1500 students for 11 special schools. It would be about 140 students per special/deaf school. As a result, that's relatively small numbers of students.
$109M for 11 special/deaf schools.
$391M for thousands and thousands of public schools in 61 local districts.
See Dr. Mowl's testimony proposal and see the last page and you will see $109M on 2010 FMAP.
http://4201schoolsassociation.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/4201_testimony_packet_2-15-2011_color.pdf
Yet, there is no history on academic standards from 4201. Sounds fishy?
White Ghost
White Ghost..
I believe the proposal that Cuomo propose was to divert funding to school districts and the school districts will give monies to 4201 schools based on how many students are referred to 4201 after they have done their evaluation.
So, expected monies are not going straight to 4201 schools. School Districts could in theory control how much money is going to 4201 schools.
Looks like NY might take this off the table and the 4201 schools will get similar cuts as rest of schools rather than more. We'll know more in April.
One thing tho, all of the deaf schools affected by "budget" isn't related to deaf issue. It's not because they're "deaf schools" nor is it because of rise in CIs. It's more related to the "budget" and finding ways to save costs. I find it disheartening that education is being targeted. America's educational system is bad, we need to get better.
Candy....
Well....I read somewhere in the internet saying that Cuomo is proposing $500K to allocate all local district schools.
All 11 schools are under the 4201. I thought Dr. Mowl's testimony proposal was pretty bad. $109M in the year of 2010 along with the 1500 students in 11 schools is pretty ridiculous. State Government should have figured it out and make the merger from 11 schools to 3 or 4 schools under the 4201. That would make Governor Cuomo very happy.
Imagine, there are about 30-40 teachers from K to 12 per school. That's also pretty small number of teachers.
I thought that the 4201 is more expensive than the rest of the local district schools.
It's all blink eye.
White Ghost
Candy....
Opps my typo...$500K. I meant to say $500M, not the $500K!
White Ghost
There's no question that the 8 schools that serves deaf/hh should be reduced.
Cuomo did say that (not targeting the deaf/hh, but ALL students)NY ranks number 34 education and NY spends highest in education - so they're not getting their money's worth. If they had spend so much on education and the results shows it..fine, but it isn't.
It is time for deaf education to look at alternatives in how they serve their program to deaf/hh population that uses sign language.
Back in the day we used to have a lot of students in the dorms, now the numbers have dwindled drastically. Student enrollment is not going to go up in the future so, they need to think of ways to keep deaf schools open in an innovative way as an option for those who choose it.
White Ghost,
You are not even close. In 2007, just for NYC alone was $17B. Says here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_Department_of_Education
So, the $109M is peanuts. Sorry to disappoint you.
Brian L. Mayes
Anyway, Mike, good compilation. It is true. So, how do we pay for education? Think about this tho.
Would it be better for the kids to all go to public schools without any support system? I don't think they will thrive. I sure as hell didn't. Not until I had an interpreter and note-taker that I ever got good grades.
So, that doesn't work.
Another ploy: mainstream the kids and setup an service program for each kid for each school. Woo, very, very expensive. You all can do the math.
So, that doesn't work.
Help me here. I think the system is at its best right now. It is the cheapest way to go and the morality for the kids is a lot higher.
Talking about weaning off, ok, let's wean off the police, firemen, forest service people and politicians. Are we depended on them? Yes, we are. Do we need them, no, not really according to your theory of your write up. We didn't need them a hundred years ago, so let's just throw them all out. We can save a ton of money, oh yea, but at what cost? Does it not apply here?
Seriously, help us our here.
Brian L. Mayes
Most late deafened or even early deafened (I was at 11yrs of age), HAVE to be innovative and get on with it, simply because no system of support or back up was there, it continued indeed STILL does well into middle and older ages too, perhaps if more deaf were pitted at the coal face they would find as we did ways and means to create alternatives and not a lifetime of reliance on others. I would never consider relying on anyone else at all and those that do, need a new mind-set in NOT accepting this is a norm, no one should be left to flounder, but help people help themselves, and get rid of dependency as any way of life..
Hiya Brian Mayes and everyone....
We ain't funny anymore, Brian M...... ;-)
Anyway, the link you provided is not enough information unfortunately. I think that NYC education is separating from NY State in funding. Sorry to say that....
However, I FINALLY found the link and it's the reliable information. That's what Governor Cuomo proposes $500M for the new program in the local school districts. Here is the link.
http://publications.budget.state.ny.us/eBudget1112/agencyPresentations/pdf/agencies.pdf
Take a look at #67 and states that
"This net change primarily reflects the loss of Federal American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (ARRA) funds, a reduction to school aid and other educational programs, and the addition of $500 million of two new performance programs or the school districts.
Then scroll down to #72. Read, "Private Schools for the Deaf and Blind" section. Consolidate? Face and accept it. It will never close to *ALL* Blind and Deaf schools but will be opening 3 to 4 schools.
1500 students in 11 schools? So, it means that there are about 140 students per school. That's relatively small numbers of students.
Think about 5 years from now....it could be down to 1K students, so, it will calucate (spell) to about 90 students per school.
Tough luck.....
White Ghost
Don't you love those beautiful bitches?
http://www.deafvideo.tv/92451
;-)
White Ghost
Hmm...
Right now, NYS is practically broke and of course, Governor Cuomo is looking at different ways to bring us out of the black hole. However, 4201 schools are really cheap, despite what the media is attempting to paint us...expensive.
The rate of inflation is 5% (or is it 4%? I don't remember) annually, at least here in NYS. Public schools tends to overspend 9% over the budget/inflation. In fact, NYS is considered the most expensive state for public schools. 4201 overspends 1.6%. That's all. I frankly think that 4201 is doing a great job, considering.
The majority of 4201 schools are located in NYS/Long Island. And it's not all about Deaf schools, even though 8 out of 11 serve Deaf students. Dr. Mowl did request that 4201 schools be treated like other public schools (facing 7% budget cut) and that the legislature set up a task force committee to discuss 4201 schools and make recommendations based on the findings. Whatever recommendations would be, we'd be able to deal with them, be more prepared, etc.
It's all about politics and money... Just like other states, public schools, closing/merging schools, etc. For me, it is personal, because my two kids attend Rochester School for the Deaf and they love it there (it's more inclusive and has better networking system with hearing community here in Rochester, NY.) I am not familiar with other 4201 schools, that I acknowledge.
Okay, take care... back to contacting the legislators and leaving comments on the online newspapers in NYS. Ta da.
Brian L. Mayes:
"So, how do we pay for education? Think about this tho."
first: taxes fund public education; secondly, public education is a misnomer and implies or infers that the government is in the business of educating children; Thomas Jefferson believed education should be left to private entities and not the government since the government could and would indoctrinate young children's minds. some believe public education is paramount to anti-democratic principles.
"Would it be better for the kids to all go to public schools without any support system?"
would it be better if all kids went to publicly-funded segregated schools? if so, who would decide which schools should receive primary funding; which would receive secondary funding?
the solution is to utilize private schools, charter schools, vouchers, or start your own school. given that the Rochester area has a few intelligent deaf teachers and professionals, there is ample reason to believe that you and your friends in Rochester could get together and create your own school.
that is the weaning away from public education that Mr. Sewell referred to, as did Mike.
if your wife started a private school, i'd be the first to offer my assistance.
Well, reading all this...
I don't see how one can compare Wisconsin Protest with what is going on with Gallaudet or even NY.
What is happening in WI has to do with the government taking away bargaining rights and nothing to do with the budget no matter what anyone who supports this right-wing, tea F party politics say.
It's already evidenced based on statements by Walker himself and his Fitzgerald side kick. Nuf said.
I don't need got go into detail, either one is aware and have kept up to date with everything from both sides. Weaning Cows from calf story probably has many in WI laughing. There were COWS at the protest! And tractors showed up too! ;)
Why are we mixing all that together?
Gallaudet is going through changes and in order for them to survive, accepting diversity is the answer.
NY 4201 school might get their funding back, but the level might drop along with rest of schools in state, definite answer in April.
Wisconsin Union, remember folks...this is a ploy to destroy Unions so Democrats won't get as much $$ in donations for the campaign and Koch Brothers will be happy and Corporate America will be happy because that means the Republicans will get lots of $$ compared to the Democrats. This is to ensure that Obama (or any other Democrats in the future) will never win the presidency. The statement to that effect is on the internet picked up by reporters and recorded on TV.
What happened in WI is an example of why we all should VOTE. Many didn't.
And as evidenced at the protest (I went there to watch Tom Morello play, originally) the people who's bargaining rights were taken away will not have great job morale if their bargaining rights are destroyed. These are the people you depend on.
If your house is on fire, remember these fire fighers (not all) are union members. If someone attacks your family, remember cops are union members. Teachers, Nurses, Snow Plowers, Sanitation workers, Forester, and and go on and on. What is happening in WI is targeting the PUBLIC EMPLOYEE's union. Not private unions.
100K people showed up yesterday in WI. This is just the beginning.
I want to mention the video link that White Ghost referred to.
There are obviously some people who do not get it.
Cheryl attacked a few people because she didn't get it.
So, I'm glad Candy (the vlogger Kissasl) and her daughter set Cheryl straight.
To the anonymous...
You said that Barry and Mike was referring to weaning away from public education. Okay...
Problem here is that not everyone can afford private education.
I was discussing this with someone, a personal friend of mine who does not even go online at all. We have concluded that, deaf school has to be there for some kids. Typically kids who cannot function in a public school. Many kids can, more than we will even admit. Social development seem to be a big thing among those who advocate or support deaf schools. I remember the kids I went to school with at a deaf school. I can't imagine how a few of them will even manage in mainstream. These are severely disabled deaf kids. Are there still kids like that now? Oh yes. (don't try and find someone to blame)
Many who advocate for inclusion will argue that segregation isn't a cool idea. Even for deaf kids.
We all have to function in the world at large, might as well start now.
Others will say that deaf schools prepare kids for the world at large after they graduate. Do they?
I'm sure there's plenty of argument to segregation and inclusion.
And...
if we don't have public education, might as well tell the government to tax us less. Do you guys realize how much property taxes goes towards public education?
LOTS.
As taxpayers, parents have a right to say how they want money being spend. It is their money after all.
As taxpayers, parents have a right to say how they want money being spend. It is their money after all.
Exactly, Candy.
As taxpayers, how would you all feel if Governor decides to release all "three strikes" sex offenders, rapists, drug busters, burglars and robberies from the Jail in order to save money?
Boom! Let's protest!
Yeah, CherylfromMA still does not get it.....Candy, In your recenet blog, you know how the diversity will not always work. I don't really think Cherylfrom MA and others don't understand how the diviersity works.
Glad those two bitches set the record straight.
I really love how they decided to use the tattoo calling "bitch" on each of their arm. It's my favorite one. :-)
White Ghost
Candy:
"We have concluded that, deaf school has to be there for some kids. Typically kids who cannot function in a public school. Many kids can, more than we will even admit. Social development seem to be a big thing among those who advocate or support deaf schools. I remember the kids I went to school with at a deaf school. I can't imagine how a few of them will even manage in mainstream. These are severely disabled deaf kids."
how do you define, "severely disabled deaf?"
there are two needs described by your comment:
1) severely disabled deaf
2) non-severely disabled deaf
is this difference highlighted
often by those who advocate deaf education?
"if we don't have public education, might as well tell the government to tax us less. Do you guys realize how much property taxes goes towards public education?"
good point. less taxes equals more spending power, more capital for people, such as enrolling children into private or non-profit programs.
also, you made a great point: "Cuomo did say that (not targeting the deaf/hh, but ALL students)NY ranks number 34 education and NY spends highest in education - so they're not getting their money's worth."
a bloated educational bureacracy, in other words.
if the Mayes started their own, private (or non-profit) school, they could conceivably become a model of self-sustainence, and not governmental dependency. that's the crux of my comment to them, as were Mr. Sewell and Mr. McConnell's, i believe.
i think we are in agreement for the most part. i think we are in disagreement on the how aspect.
i appreciate and enjoy your thoughtful comments and hope to continue discussing this with you.
Ahhh...we the Mayes has NO plans to start their own school :) We are just simply advocating. However, our son has goals to become a teacher in the future so I leave that to him ;-p
Thanks for your kind comments tho.
Oh god, maybe I got a little out of hand. It is so frustrating. There are (or is it were) all these options and then they want to cut it off. Ok, we are too dependent.
If there was no other educational options then I would home-school my kids. Kids would hate me cuz they love their friends and classroom environment. But then like the post, time to wean.
I don't know what to say. Or for that matter, do. But not to worry, we have a backup plan. And I guess that is all I can do.
Us, set up a school? Heh heh. Sorry, we just have enough patience to be parents only! ;-) Thanks for the complement (sp?) tho.
But hey, I'm open to ideas! Most definitely!
Brian L. Mayes
Anonymous..
To be specific, they may have other disabilities such as autism, Asperger, etc. Others have learning disabilities and/or are developmentally delayed for whatever reasons. Others might not have strong English base nor understanding of language even tho they use sign language. These kids don't have much hope as far as going to liberal arts college. Some might get into a technical college, most are trained in certain vocational skills.
Non-severely disabled deaf are the ones that have the capability to do work as instructed without much additional help. This category of kids typically go to either a Liberal Arts (Gallaudet) or Technical colleges such as NTID or other local community college or even public universities. They learn as they are taught.
That's based on my experience when living on campus at a deaf school during high school. Same applies to younger kids. I used to have a job where I would work with the younger kids as a house parent helper.
No, they're not highlighted by those who advocate for deaf education. Which is why it is interesting how people will advocate for one approach: Bi-Bi, saying that ASL/English is the answer, when in reality it isn't the answer for all deaf/hh.
I also don't know if many people realize that 4201 schools are considered "private" schools that get state funding. I'm not too versed on the history of 4201, how it came to be. So, perhaps looking at that, we might get a better understanding. There is another category in NY, I believe it is 4401 schools or funding, that is for "special education." which the 4201 does not fall under.
The Mayes could. But, they would have to find and get funding and if history is a precursor for the Mayes, they most likely will homeschool their kids if RSD is no longer open. I'm guessing.
No problem, I appreciate being able to discuss this with you as well. ;)
Am still looking for the history of 4201.
Came across this article. Another perspective encouraging change in how 4201 schools are funded.
http://www.lohud.com/article/20110311/OPINION/103110316/Reforming-funding-4201-schools-right-thing-do
Another thought:
New York School for the Deaf in Rome is 'the' state school for the deaf. That school is not being affected. I am still not understanding why NY has all these schools. It is not such a BIG state. Population wise, it's not much different from LA. CA has two schools for the deaf that is state funded.
Hmmm interesting.
Note "low-incidence disabilities"
http://4201schoolsassociation.wordpress.com/about-us/
I know..
I should do my own blog. But, don't have time.
If anyone is interested, you can check out the section 4201 and 4401 and the proposal:
Section 4401 (special education in NY)
http://law.onecle.com/new-york/education/EDN04401_4401.html
Section 4201 (and subsequent sections) Instruction of Deaf and Blind:
http://law.onecle.com/new-york/education/EDN0T6A85_A85.html
On both pages, see bottom for more links to subsequent sections.
The proposal:
(be careful to note different sections)
http://www.deafnyaction.org/?page_id=5
Candy.....
Where did you get the information about New York School for the Deaf in Rome is not being affected?
Karen/Brian M....you both raised your kids successfully. Take a hard look at your kids....they love to read some books. Keep it up. There are many wonderful homeschool activities and programs in online. Barry aka The Holism has three kids who are now homeschoolers. You can ask him for the advice. Perhaps you can contact him via youtube email if you have the account.
It's never too late.
White Ghost
White Ghost..
It is not part of 4201 schools. Not on the list. There is "New York School for the Deaf (Fanwood)" and that one is part of 4201. New York School for the Deaf in Rome is not on the list.
One more thing, I took note of is..
Howard Rosenblum, the CEO of NAD (wasn't yet a CEO when he gave speech in Albany Rally on 3/10/11) said that the 4201 proposal is "Illegal and wrong". He claims he knows special education law by heart. I don't doubt that. Probably so as it applies to US law. But, each state has their own laws and I'm wondering exactly why it is illegal and wrong. The thing is, he never explained why. Well, it was a rally. But, still, I'm curious as what is illegal about the proposal. Have left a comment over at Barb Digi's and hopefully someone can respond to that one.
It's obvious the Mayes kids loves RSD. So, I do empathize with them.
Candy--
I think I understand why....New York School for the Deaf in Rome is not part of the 4201. It's a part of NYS' University of the State of New York which is under the "state-aid" organization. It's also called "P-12." They are in the safe zone.
So, that means the 4201 cannot consolidate NYSD in Rome.
http://usny.nysed.gov/about/
White Ghost
Candy, again....
Howard Rosenblum mentioned that it's the illegal and wrong. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk.....He and his NAD attorneys will have to roll up their sleeves to work all the way up to the Supreme Court. Can NAD afford it? I doubt it. The other hand, the Appeal of Court and Supreme Court will do their homework about the deaf school's closings in the past. Don't you forget that. They are not that too dumb.
This is going to be a very tough task for him and the NAD. :-/
Inclusion is illusion? Chuckles. Scratching my head.
White Ghost
White Ghost..
Thanks!
NY is strange.
Too many schools.
They should consolidate.
Here's link to NYSD in Rome:
http://www.p12.nysed.gov/specialed/nyssd/programs/
White Ghost..
lol
I know. That's the message I left at Digi's blog: The inclusion is illusion part, I'm not quite so sure. I mean, if one size don't fit all then it clashes with inclusion is illusion.
Deaf spoecific education hardly works does it ? It cannot provide the skills to work with hearing because deaf are mostly isolated in these places,the real work starts when deaf LEAVE school and the system has to fund endless support for them to get jobs, gain more literacy learn how to work outside the deaf area, it is because the deaf schools work in a vacuum. Deaf awareness then is a complete failure after, since the 'deaf way' is ingrained in them after an deaf education and they neither know or want different, and armed with culture as a shield, the confusions go on... Too many deaf children leave school and just cannot cope with the non-deaf world. It's not non-awareness as such with mainstream of deaf,but of non-inclusive policies by the deaf areas themselves. Armed even more by disaffected deaf adults who insist the mainstream is to blame for everything and THEY, have to adapt to the deaf or the deaf won't bother, inclusion is oppression etc, suicidal ! If all the world signed these people still wouldn't change.
:-) White Ghost... I did homeschool for a few months until my hubby got laid off from his job. Then we moved back to Rochester and re-enrolled my kids at RSD. They like there. If the budget gets to be passed as it is, I will homeschool my kids. I don't know about my teenage son... he'd have to decide what he wants to do, and we haven arrived at this point yet.
Karen M....
I am so sorry to hear that your husband got laid off. Glad to know that everything in your situation has been settling down.
Without the internet, we would not have known about the homeschooling program. As for your son, let him decide what he really wants, however, he primarily needs to get English, math and science class in order to prepare for the College.
Best of Luck. Please give us some status when the 4201 approaches from the legislation, Assembly and State Senators.
White Ghost
This is interesting:
"The benefits the deaf have derived from the special schools for their education is evidenced by their home life, by their status in society, in the marts of industry and in the political community. they pursue with skill and ability almost every occupation in which the sense of hearing is not ultimately essential. The percentage of incompetents is so low as to be almost negligible." Silent Worker, 1917
To the anonymous who asked me to describe severe disabled deaf. I think the simplest way to describe it would be "incompetents".
Also, DonG's video on mainstreaming failed is erroneous because after reading the whole report several times and discussing it with someone who is well versed in research and data collecting - to make sure my conclusion is correct, I find DonG's declaration irresponsible. That study's true purpose to me, isn't about mainstreaming failing. The study does not compare mainstreaming vs deaf schools.
Candy:
i apologize for the delay in responding to you; nonetheless, i appreciate and thank you for continuing.
first, my point regarding the Mayes was from a perspective of them as advocates and not necessarily as concerned parents: the Mayes, along with their contacts in Rochester, could seek an alternative (a private or non-profit) venue to educate deaf and children with hearing loss in accordance to their beliefs. establishing a non-profit or private (or charter) school is always an option for those who are passionate about educating young children. my suggestion fits with Mr. Sewell and Mr. McConnell's suggestions in regards to weaning away from governmental dependency.
a reason to inquire about how children with hearing loss or deafness are labeled in terms of deaf education is because the fact sheet Dr. Grushkin cited in his YouTube utilized:
". . . a single federal hearing impairment category, [the] sample data did not differentiate students in that category by level of impairment."
additionally, research supports the fact a majority of children with hearing loss or deafness have multiple disabilities, which seems to be rarely addressed in most studies involving deaf education (and please correct me if i am wrong). it is possible you may have read claims made by deaf residential program directors or professionals that their overall student test scores were skewed due to severely disabled deaf students who routinely scored far lower than those without severe disabilities. conversely, a hearing impaired child with dyslexia may not fare well in an English comprehension class independent of hearing impairment, though the lower scores may be reflected as caused by the hearing impairment in a fact sheet (or journal) such as the one Dr. Grushkin cited.
it is interesting, too: i have read complaints and claims made by several deaf people who believe school districts manipulate their student counts of the disabled to pad their overall receipts of governmental money; the same applies to deaf residential schools, especially in the context of severely disabled deaf.
what you think?
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